Interview with Author Martin Aston – 4AD Biography – Part 2
by Killian Laher

No More Workhorse spoke to journalist and author Martin Aston about his 4AD book and got his thoughts on music.

NMW: Was there anybody that you wished you could have spoken to for the book?

MA: Well, the thing about the new updated version of the book is that I did manage to get Elizabeth Fraser this time. Whereas the first time around, she shared an email that time with her partner, Damon Reece, and my theory is that he never showed her the emails because apparently she didn’t know about the book. It’s possible that he was protecting her, but that’s just my theory. It was just still too raw to talk about the Cocteau Twins and things between the members of the band, or between her and Robin, and between them and 4AD. Of course, they have been reissuing Cocteau Twins albums in recent years, including the two albums that came out on Fontana (Four Calendar Café and Milk & Kisses) after they left 4AD. So the relationship with 4AD is better, and the relationship between themselves is better. But her manager said she won’t do it. Then a week later, she said yes.

The only person that I didn’t get both times was Nick Cave, because I was told he didn’t have time.  I only needed half an hour.  There were only two Birthday Party albums; they probably never even asked him.  I wasn’t going to try and go and get him directly because that’s not the way to do it. People don’t even think about the fact that the Birthday Party were on 4AD.  It’s not a flagship band, even though they’re a very important band. Signing the Birthday Party led to Cocteau Twins because it was the Birthday Party who told Cocteau Twins about 4AD. They’re very integral to the story. Two of the members are dead. I did speak to Mick Harvey, so I do have the Birthday Party represented in the book. But I did 115 interviews anyway, so you can’t do everything.

NMW: With the anniversary edition, was that planned first and then you got in touch with Elizabeth Fraser?

MA: I thought if ever I’m going to do a new version or an anniversary edition, it should be the 13th year because the first ever birthday that 4AD celebrated was their 13th, when Ivo had staged a week-long show of concerts, and there was an exhibition called The Thirteen Year Itch, which is a play on The Seven Year Itch. That was very much part of the whole story about him moving to America and drawing a line underneath everything that had gone on up until that point.

The Thirteen Year Itch was that watershed mark. I always thought that it would be good if I did something, I would tie it into the 13th anniversary. I went to the publishers and said, I’d really like to do a 13th anniversary of the book.  There’s a whole 13 years of a new audience who don’t know the story of 4AD. Maybe they don’t know there’s a book. So suddenly I can get more presence again on shelves or shops. It gave me a chance to bring the story up to date, cover things like Vaughan’s death, and speak to Liz. She’s lost her memory of things, like I have over various things. There were a few things that I couldn’t really get as much detail as I wanted. Maybe 13 years ago, I would have got a bit more, I don’t know. But anyway, I was just absolutely thrilled that she said yes.  It’s her first in-person interview in 13 years.  The last time she did a Cocteau Twins-related interview was when she did a solo show, the Meltdown show at the South Bank in 2012.  I was just happy to have her and have her take part. So in a way, there’s a sense of closure.

NMW: For the uninitiated, where would you start with 4Ad?

MA: I’d say, listen to Song to the Siren, This Mortal Coil version, because it’s extraordinarily beautiful and special, and it’s Cocteau Twins under another name in a way, but with Ivo’s input as well in terms of how he envisaged it. It’s only three minutes, but it would be a perfect introduction. Then I’d say maybe a 4AD compilation, though Ivo hates compilations. Listen to the first Throwing Muses album. Pixies. So many different bands. Red House Painters, a very important band to Ivo. The first two Red House Painters records. Then I’m sure your curiosity will be piqued, and you move on to other jewels there. But that’s enough for now.

NMW: Do you still get excited about music?

MA: Sure. I was out last night at a gig. I went to see an all-female trio, amazing singers by the name of Folk Bitch Trio, from Melbourne. I used to go to 170 gigs a year for 40 years or whatever. When COVID broke out, I realised it was quite nice not to have to go out all the time. I don’t know whether it was a change of mind or whatever, but I probably only go to about 70 gigs a year now, so maybe more one a week rather than three a week, or two and a half a week. The problem now is that it’s a real luxury. It is a complaint on one level because it’s impossible to deal with the volume of music I get given. I’m drowning in music, and I really feel that if people are going to send me music, I should try and listen to it. But I get about 160 albums a month, roughly. I don’t listen to blues, I don’t listen to hard rock, heavy metal, I don’t listen to particularly music that’s in the charts.  Hip hop is not a strong point of mine in terms of knowledge. I whittle it down, but it’s still 150 albums a month at least. It’s impossible to truly form an opinion quickly. You have to listen to something quickly because you can’t listen to 150 whole albums. You have to be incredibly quick and go, okay, that can get through to the next round. Sometimes I can hear a record, and I listen the whole way through because I’m immediately captured. I don’t like having to make snap judgments, but I’ve got no choice because bands now, artists, they don’t need a record company, they don’t need a press officer, they don’t need a distributor. They can get hold of me through my website or they get hold of me because someone’s given them my email. So I can just get sent music, whether there’s an industry structure in place or not. It’s just a lot. So it dampens the enthusiasm when you feel that you’re wading through so much music.

But I probably spend a bit more time trying to hear music that I love, and go back to old favourites. If I’m in the car, I’ll listen to old stuff. If I’m going for a walk, I’m quite old-fashioned in that I’ve got a little MP3 player rather than stuck on my phone, and it just has 5,000 songs on it. It could be lots of new stuff. I was listening to new stuff last night on the way to the gig, but I might listen to an old Bowie record just because I need a break from thinking about new music. Because you can start thinking about: what do I think of it? What might I write about it? Should I be writing about it? I mean, it’s a luxury, I’m incredibly lucky. I’ve had nearly 45 years of writing about music. I was a music fan from the age of three or four. And then I love writing. So, how amazing to be able to mix the two.

The problem is that all the stuff online, I think people are writing more from enthusiasm, and they’re not paid in the same way, so it’s less of a career. I’m sometimes suspicious of people’s knowledge of music when they’re writing, because I think if it’s not what they’re driven to do as a career, I don’t know how much knowledge they have. It’s just that, as someone who’s written about music and been very fortunate to do so, and had the ability with so many paid gigs over the years, I think I was in a very privileged (position)… It was a golden age.

Now, I don’t know whose opinion to trust anymore. When I read the music press, you stuck with people, and you knew that they had experience, and they were writing a lot. Now, this is a ‘scatter shop’. There are so many different people writing and so many online… I don’t know who to trust. I don’t know whose opinion to follow. So it’s tricky. I’m not sure what I really think about all that. I still want people to recommend things because I want to discover. You don’t go into record shops in the same way that you used to.